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MCSPOCKY

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Arizona's New Immigration Law and Racial Discrimination

Mon May 3, 2010 1:39 AM EDT
us-news, republicans, immigration, racism, conservatives, arizona, discrimination, hispanics
By McSpocky

Live Poll

Do you agree with Arizona's new immigration law?

View Results
  • 95842
    No, I am against the new immigration law.
    44%
  • 95843
    Yes, I am for the new immigration law.
    56%
  • 95844
    I don't know if the new law is good or bad.
    0%

VoteTotal Votes: 54

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Since I have seeded a few stories about the new immigration law in Arizona, such as "Arizona, Equal Rights Unless You're Hispanic?", I have been surprised and appalled at some of the comments I have read throughout Newsvine. It seems there are a lot more really bigoted people than I had ever imagined. (I had imagined there were a lot!) There also seems to be a lot of people who are really naive about civil rights and racial discrimination.

I feel the biggest problem with the law is the problems arising from the racial profiling that are bound to result. How do you tell an illegal immigrant from a legal immigrant? Are you okay with the police stopping and questioning anyone who doesn't look like a U.S. Citizen? For that matter, what does a U.S. Citizen look like?

If you have a Spanish accent, are speaking Spanish, or have brown skin, you are much more likely to be stopped, questioned, and asked to show your "papers" than if you look and sound European, for example. I don't think an illegal immigrant in Arizona from Ireland will have to worry very much about being hassled by the police.

Arizona is an overwhelmingly white state, and virtually all illegal immigrants—perhaps about half a million in the state—are Hispanic. Whom else would cops suspect and arrest but the brown ones? Even American Latinos who happen to be out without their driving license might be at risk.

Illegal immigration was already a federal crime. The new law, however, makes it a state crime and requires the police, as opposed to federal agents, to make arrests and check the immigration status of individuals who look suspicious to them. Citizens who think their cops are not vigilant enough are encouraged to sue their cities or counties, and no city or county may remain a “sanctuary” where this law is not enforced.

Arizona’s Latinos have not mobilized politically. They make up 30% of the state’s population, but only 12% of the electorate. And many are from families that have been American for generations, no longer speak Spanish, and are ambivalent toward the new arrivals. This is something that may soon change as a side effect of the new law.

A detrimental side effect of the new law, voiced in a letter to the school, University of Arizona President Robert Shelton said the college is feeling the effects of the state's new immigration law -- by losing students.

He wrote:

"We have already begun to feel an impact from SB1070. The families of a number of out-of-state students (to date all of them honors students) have told us that they are changing their plans and will be sending their children to universities in other states. This should sadden anyone who cares about attracting the best and brightest students to Arizona.

Additionally, large numbers of UA students, faculty, staff, and appointed professionals have expressed concerns that they or members of their families or their friends may now be subject to unwarranted detainment by police. Many of these individuals are from families that have been residents of Arizona for generations. While I am completely confident that no one need fear the way that UAPD will approach the application of this law, I nevertheless appreciate the anxiety that friends and colleagues are feeling. It is a concern and fear that no one should have to harbor."

There have also been numerous calls to boycott Arizona because of the new law. This isn't the first time Arizona has been boycotted for racial discrimination. The state lost about 170 conventions from 1990 to 1993 from boycotts because of the state's failure to approve a Martin Luther King, Jr. holiday.

So the next question is, what are going to be the ramifications of Arizona going out on its own, and passing this new law? Only time will bring us the answers.

  • Enjoy this article? Help vote it up the 'Vine.

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Published to:

  • McSpocky's Column, All of Newsvine
  • Groups: Hate Watch, Heated Debate, Hispanics, Legal/illegal Immigration
  • Regions: none
  • Public Discussion (33)
George-369262

I am all for the AZ law.....say what you want, we have a huge problem which is the responsibility of the Federal government, which they have largely blown off....if you are for open borders, and don't care about the economic costs imposed upon the states and country, don't care about the American citizens being murdered by violent illegals, and in fact only care about 'feeling good about yourself ' as long as someone else pays the cost, simply say so....

  • 7 votes
Reply#1 - Mon May 3, 2010 2:13 AM EDT
virginia-1492786

George, I think you have said very well what so many Americans think about this law. I agree completely that we have to do something to stop the US from being overrun by criminals invading and spreading their gangs, drugs and mayhem.

I support AZ and hope that other states nearby the southern border will follow suit.

  • 3 votes
#1.1 - Mon May 3, 2010 4:20 AM EDT
Santino42

I agree completely that we have to do something to stop the US from being overrun by criminals invading and spreading their gangs, drugs and mayhem.

And what about the undocumented workers that don't spread gangs, drugs and mayhem?

  • 3 votes
#1.2 - Mon May 3, 2010 10:17 AM EDT
Luke Wright

And what about the undocumented workers that don't spread gangs, drugs and mayhem?

They need to be sent back home to apply for citizenship like the people who do it the right way. They are here illegally. They are criminals as soon as they cross the border.

  • 3 votes
#1.3 - Mon May 3, 2010 11:14 AM EDT
Santino42

They need to be sent back home to apply for citizenship like the people who do it the right way.

Yes that nice and easy immigration process...piece of cake.

  • 4 votes
#1.4 - Mon May 3, 2010 11:28 AM EDT
Mary-268849

And this too...the government needs to fix. Evil flourishes when CONgress does NOTHING!!!

    #1.5 - Mon May 3, 2010 12:44 PM EDT
    Luke Wright

    Yes that nice and easy immigration process...piece of cake.

    Why should it be easy to gain citizenship in the USA? You want to come here...earn it!

    • 1 vote
    #1.6 - Mon May 3, 2010 1:21 PM EDT
    Santino42

    Why should it be easy to gain citizenship in the USA?

    Who said anything about easy?

    You want to come here...earn it!

    How did you earn it Luke?

    • 1 vote
    #1.7 - Mon May 3, 2010 1:34 PM EDT
    Luke Wright

    How did you earn it Luke?.

    I'm an American, I don't have to earn it. I was born here. You wanna come here from another country you gotta pay your dues. a.) learn ENGLISH b.) learn USA history c.) APPLY FOR and WAIT for citizenship. Cross the border illegally and you are a criminal.

    • 1 vote
    #1.8 - Mon May 3, 2010 1:53 PM EDT
    Santino42

    I'm an American, I don't have to earn it. I was born here. You wanna come here from another country you gotta pay your dues.

    It must be nice...so was I.

    So tell me since you were "born here" and have such an inflated sense of self entitlement who are you to suggest if someone immigrating to the US should have to "pay their dues" when you paid none?

    • 4 votes
    #1.9 - Mon May 3, 2010 2:04 PM EDT
    Rhazes

    These Amnesty and Welfare for all people make me sick. They have no clue the damage adding 15 million people will do. Chain Immigration is a FACT those 15 Million will be 50 Million with in 10 years. Since, 2000 Arizona's population has increased 28%, Texas 25%. Austin which is a sanctuary city population has increased by 48% since 2005. Both these states populations are expected to go up another 30% by 2020. They already have water shortages as it is.

      #1.10 - Mon May 3, 2010 2:16 PM EDT
      Luke Wright

      So tell me since you were "born here" and have such an inflated sense of self entitlement who are you to suggest if someone immigrating to the US should have to "pay their dues" when you paid none?

      I don't have an "inflated sense" of anything Santino42. I am an American, plain and simple. I don't have to "pay dues" to live here because I'm already an American, it's my right. If I wanted to emmigrate to Mexico or anywhere else in South America I would have to go throught that countries rules and regulations to try and do so. I appears that Mexico offers up nothing but restrictions for those wanting to emmigrate there. If I cross into Mexico illegally and they catch me then I will be in a whole lot more trouble than the illegals here. If you want to come here, good for you, wait your turn.

      • 1 vote
      #1.11 - Mon May 3, 2010 2:21 PM EDT
      Santino42

      They have no clue the damage adding 15 million people will do.

      And how much money/damage would deporting 15 million undocumented workers have/do on/to the US?

      • 3 votes
      #1.12 - Mon May 3, 2010 2:23 PM EDT
      McSpocky

      Out of curiosity, have you read this?

      Violence is not up on Arizona border despite Mexican drug war

      • 2 votes
      #1.13 - Tue May 4, 2010 5:08 AM EDT
      McSpocky

      And especially this?

      A majority now work for mainstream companies, not fly-by-night operators, and are hired and paid like any other American worker.

      Here Illegally, Working Hard and Paying Taxes

      • 2 votes
      #1.14 - Tue May 4, 2010 5:51 AM EDT
      Reply
      Carloz

      Thanks for the article, McSpocky. My vote was "no." As I said on another seed:

      It is a difficult problem, but this kind of approach is not the answer. First of all, we are not going to simply be able to get rid of the people who are already here illegally. Just think about the cost of trying to deport millions of people and keeping them out, and the loss to the economy (bills they are currently paying, e.g., rent, food, utilities, etc.), and compare that to the cost of amnesty/legalization, and the gain to the economy that would bring (e.g., additional payments these folks would then have to make in local, state and federal taxes, social security, etc.). Secondly, if immigration reform is going to be sensible, it needs to emphasize penalizing employers who hire people illegally. If there were no illegal jobs, then we would not have the influx of people taking them. Attack the problem at it's root -- the employers.

      I am in favor of reform that includes amnesty (and I should add here conditional amnesty, for example, no criminal record, pay back taxes, etc.), with a new law that emphasizes policing and punishing people/companies that employ people illegally. Oh, and I think we I think we should also establish a guest worker program.

      • 8 votes
      Reply#2 - Mon May 3, 2010 5:28 AM EDT
      Midwestlady

      Carloz -

      I agree and disagree -

      The Federal governemnt has blown this off for decades and true reform has been needed for decades. Republicans and Democrats continue to sit on their collective tushes and do nothing. Obama says the Congress may not have the "appetite" to deal with immigration this year. That is crap! All politicians want to wait until after elections so they dont lose votes. Washington is full of WIMPS! They are not going to move on this.

      AZ has been asking for Federal help on illegal immigration for years and gotten none. Murder, kidnapping, drugs, human trafficking have become so bad in the state that they HAD to do something.

      You make excellent points towards true Federal Reform of Immigration Laws. I have always respected your views and comments (with a very few exceptions).

      Here is my view on it. After reading the bill, and the trailer bill and the Federal law statutes and the US Constitution. (yes my eyes hate me right now) The AZ bill is valid and corrilates with Federal law and US Constitution. This AZ bill is not what we may need as a country, but until Washington finally and definatively sets about Federal reform on immigration laws, this is what AZ needs to deal with the many issues they have as a result of the illegal immigration into their state.

      • 4 votes
      #2.1 - Mon May 3, 2010 9:19 AM EDT
      Rhazes

      The costs of mass deportation is estimated at 40-50 Billion a year for 5 years. The cost of Illegals nationwide is Estimated at 338.3 billion a year. Its affordable and attainable.

      • 2 votes
      #2.2 - Mon May 3, 2010 2:22 PM EDT
      Carloz

      Hi Midwestlady,

      Thanks for the feedback. One positive thing I can say about this bill is that at least it has brought the issue to the forfront of national attention, where it needs to be. Unfortunately, as you pointed out:

      All politicians want to wait until after elections so they dont lose votes. Washington is full of WIMPS! They are not going to move on this.

      I'm afraid you may be right there. They failed to tackle it in 2006, and it'll be ashamed if they fail again in 2010.

      Rhazes, can you give us a source for thos figures, please?

      • 5 votes
      #2.3 - Mon May 3, 2010 2:26 PM EDT
      Midwestlady

      Carloz -

      The AZ bill has definately brought the issue to the forfront, which I suspect was one of the bill main designs.

      I also feel AZ has tried, especially with the modified language signed in to law on Friday, to make this law airtight and conform with Federal statute.

      • 3 votes
      #2.4 - Mon May 3, 2010 4:00 PM EDT
      McSpocky

      Rhazes The costs of mass deportation is estimated at 40-50 Billion a year for 5 years. The cost of Illegals nationwide is Estimated at 338.3 billion a year. Its affordable and attainable.

      The 338.3 billion a year figure is absolutely incorrect. That is a figure being circulated in an email that is being forwarded, and has absolutely no basis in fact.
      Please read here: Cost of Illegal Immigrants | FactCheck.org

      • 3 votes
      #2.5 - Tue May 4, 2010 5:14 AM EDT
      Reply
      Midwestlady

      MCSPOCKY -

      AZ has signed in changes to the language and terminology used in the bill, to make clear what is "Lawful contact" and requirements of suspicion:

      http://www.azfamily.com/news/local/Ariz-lawmakers-OK-changes-to-immigration-law-92477214.html

      I hope this might clear up some of the protested issues.

      • 2 votes
      Reply#3 - Mon May 3, 2010 9:25 AM EDT
      McSpocky

      I looked at that, but I still feel with almost certainy that racial profiling will really come into play here. Really, how can it not?

      Here is one newsviner's article that I think is of interest to read.

      Jose, Carlos, and Felipe Are Riding a Bus

      • 2 votes
      #3.1 - Tue May 4, 2010 4:36 AM EDT
      Midwestlady

      Well, I certainly understand your point and the point of the linked article. But this problem of illegal immigrants in AZ is getting out of hand and how can we stop it if the Federal government does not do thier jobs?

      http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2010/04/16/20100416shuttleraids0416.html

      Well, I can see why you would think so, but look at the problem logically. Since AZ and Mexico's border is there, obviously, and the major influx of illegal immigrants is from Mexico, again obvious, it is human nature and logical to profile illegals in AZ as having Hispanic characteristics.

      Having said this, since logically many legal residents and US citizens of AZ have Hispanic lineage, I believe that the bill will be enforced more on evidence other than racial profiling.

      Since police just can not randomly stop someone on the street, as stated in the bill. Police have to have valid reason to stop someone: busted tail light, speeding, investigating and incident called in, ect..And a reasonalbe suspicion that somene is here illegally/or participating in criminal activity: no ID, giving conflicting anblers, acting overly nervous, running from the police etc.

      • 1 vote
      #3.2 - Tue May 4, 2010 8:31 AM EDT
      McSpocky

      I'm not a Latino living in Arizona, and I can think of some of the times I have been stopped basically for no reason. Driving 3mph over the speed limit. Having a muddy license plate. (which was still easily readable btw) The police have no problem making up a "legitimate reason" if they really want to pull a person over.

      • 1 vote
      #3.3 - Wed May 5, 2010 5:35 PM EDT
      Midwestlady

      Yeah, I can think of a couple of times that happened myself. I did not get a ticket, just a warning.

      Look there are a few bad apples here and there in all businesses, and careers. Bad cops, bankers, teachers, politicians (maybe more on average in this category), etc... And this world is imperfect and so are we all.

      I like Rudy Guiliani's ideas of using day/night/thermal vision cameras, pressure sensors, 16000-20000 trained and armed new border patrol and 80 - 120 observation stations set up along the border in 12 - 20 mile increments. I solves alot, but is the Federal government doing anything? (Dont get me started on that bill Reid introduced - it is too vague on actions.)

      • 2 votes
      #3.4 - Thu May 6, 2010 10:41 AM EDT
      Reply
      Alex, Lou KY

      The law is like using a sledgehammer to put a nail in a wall. The law itself is impossible to defend on the basis of criteria in which a citizen or immigrant, could be detained for not having a way to have themselves 'documented'. You can not use 'well if your an American you have nothing to worry about', because, again the criteria for documentation is not specified in the law. If I am in error, please feel free to highlight specifically in the bill that it is at because I have never seen it when reading.

      Now saying that, I agree that there is something that needs to be done with the illegals immigrants, and amnesty is not the answer. The best I can think of is the Wisconsin bill that failed to pass, ironically, because it focused on businesses who were to be punished for the illegal act of hiring undocumented immigrants in a severe way. (seven years of ineligibility for tax breaks and such)

      • 2 votes
      Reply#4 - Mon May 3, 2010 12:26 PM EDT
      Mike-1298933

      Are the parents going to send their kids to college in a state that doesn't have illegal immigrants?

      Name one!!

      Perhaps the threat of this new law will send some of the illegals back over the border to formally start the citzenship process. I would be the first to welcome them at that point.

      I get a kick when the media runs a story of a family that has been here for years (illegaly which they never use that word in the article) and they are wondering what the fuss is all about.

      That is your government at work. Do nothing about a known problem for decades then it becomes almost impossible to enforce your own existing laws.

        Reply#5 - Mon May 3, 2010 10:13 PM EDT
        McSpocky

        Many Illegal Immigrants Pay Up At Tax Time

        Ford, of Middle Tennessee State University, said a majority of economists agree that illegal immigrants are a net benefit for the U.S. economy.

        He said the tax contributions from illegal immigrants, including sales taxes, property taxes and excise taxes (such as the gas tax), are significant.

        He calculates that illegal immigrants contributed $428 billion dollars to the nation's $13.6 trillion gross domestic product in 2006.

        • 1 vote
        Reply#6 - Tue May 4, 2010 5:03 AM EDT
        McSpocky

        Illegal Immigrants Are Bolstering Social Security With Billions

        Another article to read...

        • 1 vote
        Reply#7 - Tue May 4, 2010 5:32 AM EDT
        black spider

        yeah, read my response. your political "pets" cost us more than they bring in.

        and they take jobs away from our citizens.

        Obama and Pelosi apparently want US citizens on welfare and unemployment, and illegal aliens working for cheap wages under poor working conditions.

        BUsh and Hastert preferred Americans to be working instead of being on unemployment, but that's the only difference, none of them care about working conditions or wages, only cheap labor and votes. There is no difference between Dem and Rep. The problem is the news media, who covers up the horrible governance by these idiots in Congress and most of the presidents.

        The same govt who barks about Chinese slave labor aids and abets a similar form of slavery in America. The govt is run by the Democratic Party, but Republicans are good at it too.

        The problem is too f'd up party systems that are more concerned with their power and votes than the citizens who elected them.

          #7.1 - Tue May 4, 2010 4:06 PM EDT
          McSpocky

          If you use the real figures, every empirical study of illegals' economic impact demonstrates the opposite . . .: undocumenteds actually contribute more to public coffers in taxes than they cost in social services.

          SSRN-Taxing Undocumented Immigrants

          Here Illegally, Working Hard and Paying Taxes - New York Times

          Illegal Immigrants Are Bolstering Social Security With Billions

          Many illegal immigrants pay up at tax time - USATODAY.com

          As to your figure of illegal immigrants collecting $32K in govt benefits, that number is completely wrong. It is a number being circulated as an email forward that someone made up.

          According to FactCheck.org, "The e-mail includes a link to a CIS report that contradicts some of the e-mail’s own claims. The report found that illegal immigrant welfare use "tends to be very low." It also estimates the total federal net cost of households headed by illegal immigrants at under $10.4 billion, a small fraction of what this message claims."

          • 1 vote
          #7.2 - Wed May 5, 2010 5:40 PM EDT
          Midwestlady

          Do you just loves governemnt agency estimates? The truth is we do not know because there is not a system in place to count how many are in this country illegally!

          The Federal government is not doing their job!

          • 1 vote
          #7.3 - Thu May 6, 2010 10:52 AM EDT
          Reply
          black spiderDeleted
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